Can anyone help please?

[Diane]

I'm just wondering if anyone can help please? I have a friend with a son who is mentally ill, but at 40 years old wont accept he needs help. He makes her life a living hell. If she puts his cheese on the wrong part of the plate, he throws it across the room at her. He shouts at her for making a noise spreading butter on her toast! He has broken so many things in the house, including tables, cupboard doors, glass oven door (twice) door frames have come away from the wall (the list goes on and on). He is up all nihgt making noise so she cant sleep and then he sleeps during the day. No job! he steals her money using his computer to buy stuff and of course he hits her, so she's scared! She is living in her house with so much clutter all around her, she is ashamed to invite anyone into her house. I think he does it on purpose to try and upset her. The hosue is so full of C*** that he buys.

I've spoken to the police who say they would arrest him of course, but unless he starts banging his head on the cell wall, then they arne't medically trained and couldn't do anything to help. Now at the moment he is a very good actor and can be perfectly delightful in front of others - so that's a non starter. His mum doesn't want to have him arrested because she does feel he needs help. She has spoken to her doctor about him, but again he can't really do anything.........anyone? suggestions? please? Getting desperate here :headbang:

 

[kitten_with_claws]

1. Her doctor is sh*t, she needs a new one.

2. Try adult social services &/or NHS Direct (do not discount the latter, they will 'phone back & they are helpful!) & ask about having him referred to the Crisis Mediation Team (or whatever it's called) - the former may also be forced to bounce her back to her GP/local hospital for direct referral but they will have advice as to what to say etc.

3. Your friend must act now & not back down/back away on the next 'good day', this is an unacceptable situation which could very well escalate into something much more serious, 'tomorrow' is not a good day to start 'phoning people if you have reached the end of your tether either.

I know it's much harder when it's somebody else that needs help, rather than yourself, as it is not always practical (if they don't want to go for example) to present them at the GP's or even A&E & demand help immediately, though that help is still available & in my limited experience, mental health problems are usually acted upon with relative swiftness, providing somebody knows you need help in the first place!

 

[Diane]

Yes I've been in touch with social services who were really helpful and tried to arrange a meeting with my friend and the police, but then my friend got cold feet an backed out. She has so many excuses...you wouldn't believe!!!! Eventually social services told me that they were very sorry but they had lots of people who wanted to be helped and needed to close my friends case.....it's all so frustrating. She keeps saying that it's fine for me to say chuck him out, but in her circumstances its not so easy....well ok, she can't drive anymore due to .....yes, you've guessed it, her son (long story) but she has friends who would help with shopping and trips out. Although why is it people of 70 and above are so independent and never like taking help offered? She would have been the first to help out a friend in need when she was younger. A nicer kinder, person you couldn't wish to meet and I just think its a horrible way to end up.

No 3....my god, you've met my friend, this is just what she says....tomorrow!

Thanks anyway and I will have another word with my friend..she did say 2013 is a time for decisions, but talk is cheap!

 

[kitten_with_claws]

I've spoken to the police who say they would arrest him of course, but unless he starts banging his head on the cell wall, then they arne't medically trained and couldn't do anything to help.

Now at the moment he is a very good actor and can be perfectly delightful in front of others - so that's a non starter.

His mum doesn't want to have him arrested because she does feel he needs help. She has spoken to her doctor about him, but again he can't really do anything.........anyone? suggestions? please? Getting desperate here :headbang:

Re. the points above, the police not being able to do anything medically etc., the quickest way to get something done is the next time he does something that might have her reaching for the 'phone to call for help, dial 999 but ask for an ambulance - if the paramedics can be satisfied that he is in need of immediate help (danger to himself/others etc.) & cart him off to hospital, he will then be in the system straightaway, bypassing the need for GP referrals & so on.

This carries an inherent risk in that, should paramedics decide he is not such an immediate threat after all, they may well go away again & leave him behind & he might lose the plot totally as soon as they've gone. Should your friend ever decide to take this route, I would strongly suggest that she has it in her mind that having him arrested there & then by the police is her only back up alternative.

If arrested, she needs to be prepared to see it through to the bitter end really, which is unfortunately probably going to be only a choice of controlling medication or a refusal to allow him to live with her any longer. This is why so many people suffer in these situations, as they are unable or unwilling to take it as far as it needs to go to enable a change in their own lives but it may not come to her worst imagined case scenario, which is what I think stops many people doing anything to even get started. xx

 

[sublime]

God, what a nightmare.

The only positive suggestion I can [sort of] offer is that my friend's partner's son had similar behaviour patterns.

It was only when he finally got treatment that his family realised what an unhappy, miserable existence he'd had. When they were at the mercy of his outbursts, it was as though he was the perpetrator and they were the victims, and in reality, he was as much a victim as they were.

What I'm trying to say is that by delaying taking action, your friend's keeping her son in what could be a daily living hell for him. He's plainly very ill, and like anyone who's ill, he needs help and support to get better.

Incidentally, the young man I referred to up there ^^^ is slowly but surely making a life for himself. There is a way forward, but sadly, for many, it takes a massive crisis before people get the help they need.

 

[Pepsidoodle]

Diane you have been given some good advice from the other posts - I just want to come along and agree with you & them, and say that your friend needs to decide what she is going to do. If her son is not actively seeking out treatment for himself it will take the pushing of your friend to get help for her and/or help for her son.
Of course one thing is certain, if she does nothing the situation will stay the same.

 

[Diane]

You're quite right, I've told her what all of you have said.
There's one thing for sure, her son doesnt think he has a problem!!! Whenever his mum has suggested paying for him to get any sort of help, he has ignored her or poo-poo'd the idea. When my son told him (years ago) he needed counselling, he got really cross - they were in his car, he hit the brakes screached to a halt and told my son to get out...he wouldn't and he is one of the few who has stood up to this "bully"

Sadly we aren't dealing with someone who is normal, you can't just say "come along we are going to the drs". If she were to call an ambulance, by the time they turned up he would be over "it"
Sublime....how did your friend start the ball rolling please?

 

[Just Beauty Direct]

Can't assist any more than the others really other than to say this is very unlikely to get better by its self and is quite possibly simply going to get worse. I agree re the ambulance if the violence persists. Other point is that if he won't voluntarily seek support and medication it may be that the only way is through the courts.
She is lucky to have a friend who cares in you.

 

[sublime]

Sublime....how did your friend start the ball rolling please?

Sadly, when things hit crisis point. The young man was arrested for being 'drunk and disorderly', when he wasn't, he was in the grip of his psychosis, late one night and wandering the streets.

Sorry, Diane, I know that's not much help.

 

[petpixie]

My heart goes out to your friend Diane. I can't imagine how awful this is for her. She obviously wants to protect her son and yet to help him she has to do what goes against the grain and get him taken into the system. What a horrendous dilemma for her. I can only echo the excellent advice given here by others. She must get him help and removed from her house before something awful occurs. Are there no other siblings/family members who can help her? Friends like you are wonderful, but sometimes having a family member working alongside you in this kind of situation makes difficult decisions easier. Poor lady I really hope 2013 is a turnaround year for her.

 

[Weathergirl]

I assume your friend know's for sure that it is a mental health problem? To me his behaviour sounds strikingly similar to most domestic violence situations only swap the husband/wife/partner for son in this case. His behaviour to me sounds like domestic abuse and violence, so unless every other perpetrator of DV is mentally ill as well it sounds like an exuse to me- although I understand completely that it must be almost impossible for her to stand up to him and instead, like many victims od DV your friend makes excuses or postpones decisive action. I am afraid that this will not end unless your friend says it has to stop and takes action.

1. I assume he has no legal right to be there. Your friend can ask him to move out. Pack his bags and put them outside. Call the police if he kicks off- a woman next door to us did this with her son and the police arrested him. His behaviour was awful but several months later he is back, taking his meds and teaching his little brother how to ride the bike he got for christmas. Don't think he moved back in though.

2.Next time it happens call 999 ask for the police. Ask them to arrest him and if your friend has the courage- press charges. Tell the police everything, all the history and don't make excuses. Treat it as a CRIME not a health issue. Believe me if he poses a risk to himself in the cells the police will have a doctor called to assess him.

2. If there is an immediate threat of violence a lawyer should be able to help with an injunction, possibly on legal aid depending on her means, and possibly to have him kicked out of the house as well as ordered to leave her alone. There are consequences for breaches too (custodial sentences included).

He would count as an "associated person" because he is a family member who lives with her. He presumably has no right to be living there and she could probably just kick him out anyway- if she can bring herself to do it. He may try the pity tactic - he has no where else to go etc- her answer should be "not my problem- your actions, and refusal to go to the doctors have left me with no choice".

I know it sounds harsh but this may be the only way. If she threatens him with this, would he change his ways?

There may be medical help that can be sought but if that has all failed- and your friend is not getting the support she needs but she continues to suffer then I am sorry but this is all she can do.

 

[Diane]

No he's an only child. Her brother is dead. Her sister in law died last year. Her brother in law lives in Canada and she doesn't want him to know how terrible her son is jsut in case she dies and her son wants to go and start a new life in Canada with them!
Her husband died of heart problems 16 years ago (the doctors had another mans file with the same name which didn't help matters - then arguments as to which hospital he was to be taken to!) his original date for his heart operation was cancelled at the last minute, and having returned home from hospital, he had a stroke and when my friend called our surgery, the doctor (not the same one she's with now) wouldn't come until she had finished her lunch - so my friend blew her top and that was when the arguments about should he go back to the london hospital or our local one..so that lost him about 6 hours...honestly this poor lady attracts bad luck. I keep telling her she should write a book, but she says no one would believe it!

 

[Diane]

"I assume your friend know's for sure that it is a mental health problem? To me his behaviour sounds strikingly similar to most domestic violence situations only swap the husband/wife/partner for son in this case. His behaviour to me sounds like domestic abuse and violence, so unless every other perpetrator of DV is mentally ill as well it sounds like an exuse to me- although I understand completely that it must be almost impossible for her to stand up to him and instead, like many victims od DV your friend makes excuses or postpones decisive action. I am afraid that this will not end unless your friend says it has to stop and takes action."

Well it's mixture of violence, stealing and extreme mood changes he's like Jekyl and Hyde, sometimes hes quite charming and other times you can almost see the black smoke coming out of his head. the language he uses on his mum is shocking. It's so bad the state they live in with rooms full of stuff, all new and just sitting collecting dust. There are 5 cars outisde, 4 just sitting rotting on the front garden. He keeps promising he will get one MOT'd and sell it. One of them is growing moss on it. He'll come down the stairs and just hit her hard on the head, for no reason. If she opens a carrier bag and shakes it to open it properly, of course it makes a noise and he goes off on one. She walks into her sittingroom and he moans that she has wrecked his computer, just by walking into her own room. I always used to think he was jsut a really nasty piece of work and she was making excuses for him, but unless he's a good actor as well.
She has asked him to move out, but of course he has nowhere to go. She is scared of him. Her house is flagged by the police so they are aware but she doesn't want him arrested as then he will have a record, and she says will never get a job - which is rather ironical as he doesn't need one with her around. I've tried to get her banks to stop all internet use, but they tell me she will need to go in and speak to the manager...I can't put a gun to her head, so she must put up with the theft! All this started when she was in hospital for 5 weeks having a skin graft on a leg ulcer, which all went terribly wrong and the ospital ended up cutting through a tendon in her foot. So she is now in constant pain!
I told him how glad I am that I'm not a neighbour as the house looks shocking and he is devaluing the houses all around, but all he said was he was glad I wasn't one of his neighbours too!
Her solicitor also knows, as does her accountant.

 

[Pepsidoodle]

It could be domestic violence, it could be mental health related, it could be both. Reading between the lines a lot it will probably take a crisis to happen before your friend does anything

Domestic violence charities would be able to give her info and support though