How misleading is this ......

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Meeshoo

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This is the speil ............

Tenner - "normally you expect rubies to have inclusions, clouds etc ..... the only reason we can do this ......... we don't have a middle man ..... we go to the mine, we buy it, we cut it so you have the benefit of the price

Vicki - "The type of jewellery boutique sourcing this material are the very high end jewellery shops you see in Knightsbridge, Rodeo Drive, Bond Street..."

Tenner - "......... even they maybe won't see this level of jewellery because to produce this quality of material there are 100s of buyers from all over the world at the mine that want this quality."

Vicki - "... we are not conditioned to believe that rubies can be this clean."

Ok. Now I know they have to have a sales pitch but this is soooooo misleading. To compare heat/treated rubies to rubies in high end boutiques is just wrong. Fine, I have no issues with heat treatment (normal heat treatment) but I object to any type of BE Diffusion. lead or glass filling no matter what you call it, being passed off as better than high quality rubies on the market. MISLEADING IN THE EXTREME. NO SELF-RESPECTING HIGH END JEWELLERY BOUTIQUE WOULD TOUCH TREATED RUBIES.

Why can't they be honest so people know what they're paying for and getting? Why can't they say "rubies, the best quality rubies, are not heated or treated. Then you have some that are just heated to bring out their colour. In order to bring you beautiful gemstones we take a natural ruby but then not only heat it but we treat it with chemical agents so that the colour is enhanced etc etc etc and that means we can offer you a wonderful looking ruby at a fraction of the price you'd pay for the best rubies in the world". Isn't that much more honest???? People would still buy but be under no illusions.
 
Meeshoo said:
This is the speil ............

Tenner - "normally you expect rubies to have inclusions, clouds etc ..... the only reason we can do this ......... we don't have a middle man ..... we go to the mine, we buy it, we cut it so you have the benefit of the price

Vicki - "The type of jewellery boutique sourcing this material are the very high end jewellery shops you see in Knightsbridge, Rodeo Drive, Bond Street..."

Tenner - "......... even they maybe won't see this level of jewellery because to produce this quality of material there are 100s of buyers from all over the world at the mine that want this quality."

Vicki - "... we are not conditioned to believe that rubies can be this clean."

Ok. Now I know they have to have a sales pitch but this is soooooo misleading. To compare heat/treated rubies to rubies in high end boutiques is just wrong. Fine, I have no issues with heat treatment (normal heat treatment) but I object to any type of BE Diffusion. lead or glass filling no matter what you call it, being passed off as better than high quality rubies on the market. MISLEADING IN THE EXTREME. NO SELF-RESPECTING HIGH END JEWELLERY BOUTIQUE WOULD TOUCH TREATED RUBIES.

Why can't they be honest so people know what they're paying for and getting? Why can't they say "rubies, the best quality rubies, are not heated or treated. Then you have some that are just heated to bring out their colour. In order to bring you beautiful gemstones we take a natural ruby but then not only heat it but we treat it with chemical agents so that the colour is enhanced etc etc etc and that means we can offer you a wonderful looking ruby at a fraction of the price you'd pay for the best rubies in the world". Isn't that much more honest???? People would still buy but be under no illusions.
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I so agree Meesh. They shoot themselves in the foot with all the misleading and incorrect information. I don't know if you remember the ruby and diamond ring I bought from Gems, rather like an overly wide George Cross? At the time you warned me that this was a nice ring but the rubies were very likely filled. I love this ring, but don't like the way it was sold to me (I am sure you were right as size and colour is too perfect and matching for the price). It is nonetheless much enjoyed, will always have some small value due to a healthy gold weight, but I would have enjoyed it even more if it had been honestly described to me. I hate being treated like an ignorant fool. At the level I am buying (£80 to £150 per piece in 9ct gold), I'm not expecting to receive the quality of gemstone that the channels purport to sell.

Argey xx
 
Completely agree,I too know that at the price I am paying (around Argey's price) I am going to get treated,heated,infused etc,etc stones. BUT don't try and fill me up with this "high end" rubbish.I haven't noticed John Scott saying this.I'd just buy from him anyway as he is so down to earth.
 
You've both proved my point and thank you for that. People will buy if the gemstones are pretty enough - irrespective of treatments - and at least won't be fooled into thinking they're buying something they're not and then getting an appraisal that shatters their dreams.

I'm positive that most people would feel far happier knowing what they've bought and being allowed to make their own judgements. How can somebody then feel cheated if they've bought knowing the full facts? I'd love to see a programme on one of these jewellery channels that actually tries to do this. I bet you the response would be good.

Arge, I'm glad you love your ring. How it looks and makes you feel is the most important aspect of jewellery buying/wearing. Wear it in great health and forget the treatment (but just don't insure it for £1m)!
 
Meeshoo said:
You've both proved my point and thank you for that. People will buy if the gemstones are pretty enough - irrespective of treatments - and at least won't be fooled into thinking they're buying something they're not and then getting an appraisal that shatters their dreams.

I'm positive that most people would feel far happier knowing what they've bought and being allowed to make their own judgements. How can somebody then feel cheated if they've bought knowing the full facts? I'd love to see a programme on one of these jewellery channels that actually tries to do this. I bet you the response would be good.

Arge, I'm glad you love your ring. How it looks and makes you feel is the most important aspect of jewellery buying/wearing. Wear it in great health and forget the treatment (but just don't insure it for £1m)!
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No prob there Meesh, I knew it would be very humble so estimated at a lowly £25,000! xx
 
I agree with you all as well. I believe that misleading and blatant dishonesty is utterly unacceptable. It annoys me, all the constant references to Boodles, Garrards and Tiffany's, Bond Street and Rodeo Drive. If they were accurately describing the stone and explaining treatments I think, as you do, that their customers would still be very happy to buy their jewellery. Perhaps more importantly, would know that the piece isn't "top drawer" as they are so fond of saying.

There is no shame in treating gemstones to enhance their beauty but it is shameful to mislead your customers.
 
I think that comparing the designs and styles etc to high end boutique jewellers is perfectly acceptable, for example, their pitch COULD be 'look at this design, it really wouldn't be out of place in Tiffany's or Bond Street or any other real high end, top quality jeweller. Now their prices are in the thousands of thousands for some pieces because they have untreated, top quality, dogs kahoonas of gem stones. What we have done is taken beautiful gem stones of a good quality and enhanced them so that they produce these really amazing pieces at prices that are not only fantastic, but affordable for everyone.'

There you go....that took me all of 20 seconds and didn't mislead anyone in any way shape or form!!! I find it concerning that they want us to part with our cash but treat us like ignorant buffoons. Surely they can see that being honest with us will only enhance our trust in them and make us more likely to part with even more cash!!!
 
Just wanted to add that TJC state that their Rubies are NEVER filled and only last week Derek had a go at "other channels" who sell glass/lead filled rubies. I remember reading somewhere that carat weight can be affected by filling too as the lead can make the carat weight higher so if you buy say a 1 carat stone it will be smaller than an unfilled 1 carat stone. Can't find where I read that though! Meeshoo (Victoria Meldrew the 2nd!!) I'm sure you'll be able to confirm that or otherwise.

Whilst Rocks do have the treatments listed on their website, I feel this is not something an inexperienced or new buyer would think to read. It feels to me as if it's there for their protection and not for the buyers. I for one went about happily buying gemstone jewellery from QVC then Gems TV when I didn't have a clue about treatments or cutting or in fact anything other than what the presenters chose to tell me! It's only since joining this forum that I have been educated and now know a lot better. Unfortunately there will be thousands of poor uneducated (in jewellery terms) people out there thinking their £499 colourless, windowed Paraiba ring is worth a fortune!!

These are interesting :-http://www.gemlab.net/website/gemlab/index.php?id=188
http://www.diamonds.net/news/NewsItem.aspx?ArticleID=19477
 
Wow... thanks for this info. I LOVE rubies (hence my user-name!) but to be honest I've no idea of the actual quality of the rubies I possess. I had assumed them to be heated and possibly filled, otherwise I wouldn't been able to afford them in the first place?! I bought a ruby pendant from tjc a few weeks ago, so it's nice to be reassured it's NOT filled!

Really don't know what to think, but thanks for this, Klosblue and Meeshoo, it's fascinating.
 
Whilst Rocks do have the treatments listed on their website, I feel this is not something an inexperienced or new buyer would think to read. It feels to me as if it's there for their protection and not for the buyers.
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I think that you're quite correct there, Klos, that it is more for the company's protection.... but what about all those folks who do not have internet access.....and there are still plenty of them..... how are they supposed to understand about, or even realise the existance , of the various treatments? They stand no chance of getting the full facts, do they?
 
I'm sure I heard Steve Bennett on coloured rocks say that a loose ruby from Thailand that he was selling was treated - still beautiful but affordable. Of course at the price on offer for a ruby of significant weight it had to be but it was at least right that he was open about it.
I've bought a lot of jewellery in the past few years - some expensive and not treated and a significant amount of lovely but much more affordable bits and pieces with treated stones. They are all good in their own way. I just wish we didn't have to read between the lines and waffle!!!
 
Mathilda said:
I think that you're quite correct there, Klos, that it is more for the company's protection.... but what about all those folks who do not have internet access.....and there are still plenty of them..... how are they supposed to understand about, or even realise the existance , of the various treatments? They stand no chance of getting the full facts, do they?
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That's an excellent point Mathilda. I never even thought about that!
 
argeybargey said:
Self, self!

xxx
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23.gif
 
I must say that this thread has been an eye opener to me!. I did know about some gems being heat treated - but as to the to other stuff mentioned in this thread - well it was news to me!!
 
Greatgable, good that you have been able to learn something from the forum posts.... that's what it's all about, isn't it? I think we can all learn "stuff" from ST.com..... wonderful place..... I just pity those with no access here who may be swallowing all the presenters' "guff" as gospel........
 
I totally agree Mathilda. I've certainly learned loads since joining this forum and dread to think what I would have wasted my money on if this forum wasn't here. As well as being educated I've made great friends, get a good laugh and can rant until my heart's content :giggle: If ST wasn't here I for one would be lost!

Graham you're a star!
 

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